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To Endorse - or Not To Endorse? That is the Question (31 posts)

  1. JohnA
    Member

    was it a vote to protect wiretapping - or was it a vote designed to defuse the "Obama is weak on nation defense" attacks that the McCain camp would most likely have employed?

    i think it is clear that Obama is attempting to move to the center, for political reasons. he needs middle america that STILL plays into the hands of the fear mongers - and who can be manipulated into thinking Obama is some weak liberal that wants to surrender.

    Clinton played the same game - cozying up to Rush Limbaugh. its politics my friends.

    now - we could debate whether compromising your ideals by voting for wiretapping - just to recast yourself in an election - is moral and justified. but - lets face it - if he does NOT win the White House wiretapping will not only become the norm - it will probably get even worse.

    Obama - as president - COULD get rid of wiretapping with one stroke of a pen.

    so which is more likely:

    1 - Obama who is considered one of the most liberal senators in congress, who's background is in community organizing and social justice, who has always had a record of championing liberal causes is REALLY running a clever charade - a ruse - and has always been a secret right wing hard-liner waiting for the right moment to seize the white house and empower the power elite?

    or

    2 - Obama knows that politics is, by its nature, an extremely dirty game in which ideologues like Cynthia McKinney and Nader and Kuccinich are IMMEDIATELY marginalized and have no chance of seizing power - so - he is playing the game and taking centrist positions as a means towards an end. He is taking pro-corporate positions as a way towards and end.

    Did you know that when Abraham Lincoln stumped in the south he sounded veeeery pro-slavery? and when he stumped in the North he sounded veeeery abolitionist?

    its politics. you may not like it - but it is how the game is played.

    i personally believe that Obama and his wife have a record that is in sharp contrast to his recent centrist positions. again - we could debate the morals of him voting for wiretapping - as a means towards a political end - but - in my opinion that is what we are seeing here. i do NOT think he ideologically supports wiretapping. i believe he wants to win this election.

    i

    Posted 16 years ago #
  2. Victronix
    Member

    i do NOT think he ideologically supports wiretapping

    That's probably true, but he is in the catch-22 situation that he cannot change the system he is a part of for the good or he will be cast out of it.

    So ultimately, his own beliefs count for zero. His willingness to protect the corporate interests is what is everything. And so we continue down the slope . . . his dozen vote protecting corporations keep him in place until he makes one vote to protect citizens and then he finds himself on the headlines with a sex scandal and he's out.

    Corporations require war to profit enough these days. That's why he will shift the troops, not return them.

    Posted 16 years ago #
  3. Victronix
    Member

    or was it a vote designed to defuse the "Obama is weak on nation defense" attacks that the McCain camp would most likely have employed? i think it is clear that Obama is attempting to move to the center, for political reasons.

    "Political" means selling us out to the corporations more than anything else. The MSM and Bush team were trying to paint the wiretapping as weak on defense but no one was buying it. That's why the Dems, Pelosi esp, were willing to openly refuse Bush's forceful demands to pass it in his state of the nation address. If it were a real point they would have shut up about it.

    Posted 16 years ago #
  4. Victronix
    Member

    $4 billion in 2005 for nukes . . .

    http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=N1w1Os8y5qk

    Matt is a real person. We had lunch with him in the month before he announced his run with Nader.

    Posted 16 years ago #
  5. mark
    Member

    It's a shame there's not a McKinney - Nader campaign.

    "We're not the Judean People's Front, We're the People's Front of Judea!"

    http://www.oilempire.us/beyond-bush.html Beyond Bush: regime rotation, not regime change

    Posted 16 years ago #
  6. Victronix
    Member

    Tell me about it . . .

    Posted 16 years ago #

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