Forum

TruthMove Forum

TruthMove Forum » TruthMove Main Forum

9/11 Truth on the NBC Nightly News ("The Commission") (13 posts)

  1. truthmover
    Administrator

    I was watching the news last night, something I rarely do, and I saw a brief segment about the publication of :

    "The Commission: The Uncensored History Of The 9/11 Investigation" http://www.911blogger.com/node/13501

    In the segment, which Brian Williams seemed a bit uncomfortable reporting, he stated that the author, a New York Times reporter, has indicated that the Commission's executive director, not mentioned by name (Zelikow), had secretly talked to Karl Rove and other members of the White House staff during the investigation.

    http://rawstory.com/news/2007/Book_Director_of_911...

    He then stated that Lee Hamilton, the Commission co-chair, had denied the validity of these claims.

    It came and went really fast just before the announcement of what was coming up after the commercial break.

    But there you have it. The MSM contradicting one of its own just to keep their story straight.

    Posted 16 years ago #
  2. Adam1
    Member

    If the connection is made between Rove and Zelikow, and it sticks, the whole web of lies starts falling apart. Zelikow's resume is one of the most outrageous aspects of the whole 9/11 fake investigation. What in the hell is a man who's academic resume is all about the creation and maintenance of public myths doing at the center of a fact finding investigation?

    Read this... “In the Nov-Dec 1998 issue of Foreign Affairs Zelikow co-authored (with the former head of the CIA) an article entitled “Catastrophic Terrorism” in which he speculated that... if the 1993 bombing of the World Trade Center had succeeded ‘the resulting horror and chaos would have exceeded our ability to describe it. Such an act of catastrophic terrorism would be a watershed event in American history. It could involve loss of life and property unprecedented in peacetime and undermine America’s fundamental sense of security, as did the Soviet atomic bomb test in 1949. Like Pearl Harbor, the event would divide our past and future into a before and after. The United States might respond with draconian measures scaling back civil liberties, allowing wider surveillance of citizens, detention of suspects and use of deadly force.” (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philip_D._Zelikow)

    The writer of The Commission, Phillip Shennon is about to get the Gary Webb treatment from the "powers-that-be." They have no choice. Zelikow is the smoking gun. We all know the story of how the reacted so viciously Gary Webb ending up taking his own life. If they go after Shennon like they did Webb, we've got to go of our way to be supportive not just now, but 10 and 20 years from now after he's not in the center of the spotlight of attention anymore.

    When people like this get their careers ruined, and their credit ruined, and their families ruined, and they can't make their house payment anymore and they're living in a one bedroom walk-up...

    ...people like us need to be dropping by their place a couple of times a week with a bag of groceries, a hand shake, and a thank you.

    Posted 16 years ago #
  3. truthmover
    Administrator

    ...people like us need to be dropping by their place a couple of times a week with a bag of groceries, a hand shake, and a thank you.

    I like your attitude here, but we should wait to see just how much of a limited hangout this book really is. From a list of articles he's written I get the sense that he may be relatively kosher. I'm assuming it won't be long before we start seeing reviews of the book from people we trust in the movement. If they indicate that he really dug in, then we might have to think about bringing the groceries before long. But I'm doubtful.

    Also, keep in mind that this guy knows what he is doing. If he is flushing his career down the toilet he would know it. And one might assume that he would turn to the movement for support at that point. But I don't think he is ending his career. Here's what I think is happening, taking an educated guess or two.

    I assume that the book is a carefully crafted assortment of specific limited hangouts written with the intent of taking a building controversy and redirecting popular consideration on the matter. In other words it serves one group of the powerful against another. That would be very much like, "Against All Enemies" by Richard Clarke which was written with the not so coded intent of supporting the CIA by shifting responsibility for not having prevented the attacks onto the Administration after they had tried to blame intelligence failures.

    But all that is just my cynical realism at work. Either way, like the Clarke book, it is likely to have a few tidbits of information that Paul Thompson and the rest of us will find useful.

    But once again, not to squash your generous intent. I think that the movement has been getting better at backing up people who support our interests, and I hope that if someone like this were actually squashed by the system that we would all try to help them out.

    Posted 16 years ago #
  4. Victronix
    Member

    I assume that the book is a carefully crafted assortment of specific limited hangouts written with the intent of taking a building controversy and redirecting popular consideration on the matter. In other words it serves one group of the powerful against another. That would be very much like, "Against All Enemies" by Richard Clarke which was written with the not so coded intent of supporting the CIA by shifting responsibility for not having prevented the attacks onto the Administration after they had tried to blame intelligence failures.

    Great summary. This is my guess as well.

    Posted 16 years ago #
  5. NicholasLevis
    Member

    People, you all need to calm down with your assumptions and extremes and prefabricated thinking patterns. They can really get in the way of seeing.

    I expect that the advance reports about Shenon's book are true and that his stories are accurate - as far as they go. What does that mean?

    It means that Shenon knew a long time ago, possibly already in 2004 while the Commission was still in session, that:

    a) Zelikow was checking in regularly with the White House (no surprise to anyone, really - just a difference in perspective on what the Commission itself was already willing to admit at the time);

    and that

    b) the Commission's questions were being passed on to Guantanomo, where prisoners were most likely subjected to torture to get answers, and then these "answers" were passed back (in the form of CIA memos) to the Commission, which was not allowed to see the prisoners or tapes of their interrogations, but went ahead and cited them uncritically in constructing its story.

    Funny, why didn't I read either of these stories in the Times before?

    If these two items had been published prominently in the New York Times as soon as Shenon learned them, it would have probably had a big impact - disrupting the propaganda operation of The 9/11 Commission Report while it was actually being applied to the national consciousness. 9/11 would have been "reopened" at the very moment that the Commission was effectively declaring it closed.

    The NYT did not publish the stories then, because of a decision either by an editor or by Shenon himself. Therein lies the cover-up.

    You can compare this to the way the NYT sat on the story about warrantless NSA spying for a year, so that they first published it after the 2004 election - guaranteeing that it had almost no effect.

    Note also that the NYT did not provide any coverage when the September 11 widows demanded Zelikow's immediate resignation for conflicts of interest already back in November 2003. Coverage at that time might have directly affected what happened next. Coverage today is historical. That's the cover-up.

    In the long meanwhile since the 9/11 CR was published, the commission chairs Kean and Hamilton themselves published a book in which they effectively confess their report is full of bullshit. At a time when it no longer mattered, they whined about how they were obstructed by the White House and how NORAD lied to them. If they had said this while still running the Commission, history itself might have slipped out of anyone's control. By saying it years later, all they are doing is to cover the most important asses in the world -- their own.

    Books don't matter very much, unfortunately. When NYT reporters keep incendiary information out of daily publication, they perform their function of supporting the state (which they know instinctively; a Mockingbird membership card is not always necessary).

    If they then take the juicy bits and put them in a book years later, when the only attention paid is within the niche market of 9/11 information junkies, well that's just good career sense. He can sell lots of books without posing a danger to the status quo, and without making a ruckus in the mainstream.

    Gary Webb broke his stories in the newspaper first. He wrote his book after he was subjected to a journalistic hit job by Pincus et al. and run out of town. Big difference.

    Pending Shenon's book itself (it may contain other revelations that get him in trouble, though I doubt it), I really don't think Shenon needs to fear the Gary Webb treatment. (If he gets it, I agree with Adam1 that we should help him get his groceries.) He walked the line effectively, which is the impression I had of him back when I saw him perform at two of the 9/11 Commission press conferences.

    And to those of you who reach for the idea of "limited hangout" every time a piece of the puzzle is given to us - please reconsider your wording. Timing is all. If these stories had come out just 3 years and six months ago, you would not have called them a limited hangout. It's more likely you would have been among those organizing the large protests at the Commission hearings.

    A limited hangout is just one of the many means by which truth is managed and mangled. The term should be used properly, to refer to when the government itself admits to a small or partial wrongdoing in order to create the appearance of openness and avoid more dramatic admissions.

    Posted 16 years ago #
  6. If the connection is made between Rove and Zelikow, and it sticks, the whole web of lies starts falling apart.

    As a people, do we want a web of lies to fall apart? Are we willing and able to suffer the consequences?

    What is in demand, truth or good mood?

    Posted 16 years ago #
  7. Victronix
    Member

    Thanks for the write-up.

    Books don't matter very much, unfortunately.

    In the long-term scheme of things, they can, if done the right way. Films make more of an impact, of course. Look at Inconvenient Truth. A worldwide movement is based off of that combined with the scientific reports that came out soon after, and still growing. Then the Nobel . .

    But the NYT seems to be infested with the worst of the worst. A lot of the myth of 9/11 was literally birthed there, particularly the myths about the destruction, created expertly. If you follow who wrote what about the towers destructions, and really look at what they wrote, you see how the whole fiction was created directly and very carefully, full of emotional appeals and manipulations.

    Here's one example:

    City in the Sky

    Two of the New York Times reporters who wrote extensively on the World Trade Center after 9/11/01, Eric Lipton and Jams Glanz, use anthropomorphic expressions to great effect. Along with Jim Dwyer, Kevin Flynn, and Ford Fesseden, they authored the series 'Fighting to Live as the Towers Died'. Glanz and Lipton went on to write 'City in the Sky', a book that chronicles the history of the World Trade Center. This book reinforces the official story of the collapses in numerous unscientific ways, one being the use of anthropomorphism.

    "But it was not just theorizing: on September 11 the columns of the twin towers really did shift load around the dark, smoking holdes punched by the planes, forming the arches and keeping the building standing. Otherwise the towers would have crumbled in a heartbeat."

    ...

    "Many of those people saw and described a structure in its final throes, as floors began to buckle, heat rose, and the building's defense systems failed."

    ...

    "Soon after Emery amd Gentul learned firsthand of the building's failing vital signs, their situation began to deteriorate."

    http://911review.com/coverup/fantasy/anthropomorph...

    Posted 16 years ago #
  8. truthmod
    Administrator

    9/11 widows call for new investigation after revelations of White House, commission ties
    http://rawstory.com/news/2008/911_widows_call_for_...

    The widows whose political activism was largely responsible for the establishment of a commission to investigate the September 11 attacks say a new book revealing the backstory of the 9/11 Commission proves that their initial concerns about its executive director were correct and demonstrate the need for another investigation.

    OPEN LETTER with attached Comment from September 11th Advocates (aka "9/11 widows")
    http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/HL0802/S00047.htm

    http://www.unansweredquestions.org/

    Will this get any coverage or just be drowned out by Super Tuesday?

    Posted 16 years ago #
  9. Victronix
    Member

    On Democracy Now this morning . . ..

    February 05, 2008 New Book Alleges 9/11 Commissioner Philip Zelikow Minimized Scrutiny of Bush Admin Failure to Prevent al-Qaeda Attack http://www.democracynow.org/2008/2/5/new_book_alle...

    Now, I will tell you, the August 6 PDB, you can make too much of it, and you can make too little of it. A lot of the information in the PDB was wrong. A lot of it was historical that dated back several years. But there were some fairly specific current warnings, current intelligence suggesting that something was going on. And it actually refers to concerns that terrorists might be conducting surveillance of the skyline of New York City and that hijacked planes might somehow be involved in whatever threat was underway.

    Posted 16 years ago #
  10. truthmod
    Administrator

    NYT book review of "The Commission"

    Tragicomic Tale of the 9/11 Report http://www.nytimes.com/2008/02/04/books/04thom.htm...

    Philip Shenon, a reporter in the Washington bureau of The New York Times, set out to get behind the scenes of the 9/11 Commission. The inside story of a government commission doesn’t sound very promising; most commission reports wind up unread on dusty shelves.

    When the 9/11 Commission announced its findings in the summer of 2004, the response was by and large respectful. Reprinted as a book, “The 9/11 Commission Report” was an instant best seller, unusual for a document written by committee. But its popularity was owed mostly to a spare, riveting narrative of the shocking events on Sept. 11, 2001, not to its policy recommendations or revelations about official malfeasance. So why go over it all again?

    Mr. Shenon is a skillful writer and storyteller as well as a dogged reporter. In “The Commission” he makes bureaucratic warfare exciting, largely because he has a keen grasp of human frailty and folly. He opens with a desperate, almost pathetic scene of Samuel R. Berger, President Bill Clinton’s national security adviser, sneaking documents out of the National Archives.

    Posted 16 years ago #
  11. PaulMozina
    Member

    Letter sent to Mr. Shenon via NYT website.

    Dear Mr. Shenon.

    I just finished reading your book The Commission The Uncensored History of the 9/11 Investigation. I hope you will take a few minutes to consider some of the issues I have with your narrative.

    On page 116 you give a brief summary of Transportation Secretary Mineta’s testimony. Unfortunately, like the 9/11 Commission, you left out some of his most revealing comments. The following is from David Ray Griffin’s book, The 9/11 Commission Omissions and Distortions pg 22.


    “As we saw earlier, Mineta said, in his testimony before the 9/11 Commission on May 23, 2003, that he arrived at the Presidential Emergency Operations Center, where Vice President Cheny was in charge, at 9:20. During Meneta’s testimony, he described the following episode:

    During the time that the airplane was coming in to the Pentagon, there was a young man who would come in and say to the Vice President, “The plane is 50 miles out,” “The plane is 30 miles out.” And when it got down to “the plane is 10 miles out,” the young man also said to the Vice President, “Do the orders still stand?” And the Vice President turned and whipped his neck around and said, “Of course the orders still stand. Have you heard anything to the contrary?”


    This omission leads to perhaps the most tortured paragraphs later in your book on page 266 where you discuss the timing of the shoot-down order:


    Farmer’s team discovered that the timing of the shoot-down order — and Bolten’s recommendation to Cheney to call the president — was memorialized in Libby’s notes, which referred to Bolten by his initials.

    Libby’s entry from 10:15 a.m. to 10:18a.m. read: “Aircraft 60 miles out, confirmed as hijack — engage? VP? Yes. JB: Get President and confirm engage order.”


    Mr Shenon, what confirmed hijack aircraft was 60 miles out at the time sighted? What exactly has Mr. Libby “memorialized” in his notes? That there is no possible way that Cheney could have issued a shoot-down order prior to 10:15 a.m. and that, of course, he got the President’s confirmation for engagement? Mr. Libby is not a very credible witness when it comes to documenting the actions of Vice President Cheny and the fact that he made the notes around 10:15 a.m. is not proof of the actual time that the discussion occurred.

    Your assertion on page 118 makes your bias clear:


    But by the time the 9/11 commission opened its doors in 2003, many of the most outrageous, if well circulated, of the theories — that the attacks were an inside job by the Bush administration, that the Twin Towers were brought down by preplaced explosives, that the Pentagon was hit by a missile and not a plane — had been well debunked.


    You are entitled to your opinion, but there are many people who would disagree. When you use the word “History” in your title, one is inclined to believe that we will in fact be reading an accurate historical narrative backed up by documented sources. But this, like so many of the other mere assertions in your book is not documented. Have you read Debunking 9/11 Debunking by David Ray Griffin? The idea that that the alternative explanations to 9/11 had or have been “well debunked” is preposterous and wishful thinking.

    On page 270 you discuss the talented FBI investigators and say:


    The honors list began with the Minneapolis agents who were rebuffed when they tried to warn FBI headquarters about Moussaoui in August 2001...”


    “Rebuffed” is hardly an appropriate term to use to describe how Colen Rowely’s request for a search warrant was thwarted. See page 92 in The 9/11 Commission Omissions and Distortions:


    At FBI headquarters, however, the request was given to the Radical Fundamentalist Unit (RFU).... The Minneapolis request was then given to the RFU agent Marion “Spike” Bowman, who lived up to his nickname by proceeding to remove the evidence that Moussaoui was connected to al-Qaeda through a rebel group in Chechnya. Then the FBI Deputy General Counsel, on the basis of this edited request, said that there was insufficient connection to al-Qaeda for a search warrant and did not even forward the request to FISA. Minneapolis FBI legal officer Coleen Rowley asked: “Why would an FBI agent deliberately sabotage a case?”


    Given the serious nature of Ms. Rowely’s assertion, it is a total mischaracterization of the incident to say that the Minneapolis agents were simply rebuffed.

    On page 307 you describe the battle to access the emergency tapes and transcripts from the police and fire departments. Then you reveal that the contents were indeed horrific. Unfortunately, again, you fail to tell the whole story. You do not mention the hundreds of testimonies of explosions going off throughout the buildings prior to their collapse. The 9/11 commission doesn’t mention them. The NIST report doesn’t mention them. How can you assert that the idea that preplaced explosives were used to bring down the Twin Towers has been “well debunked”? Apparently, only by ignoring the evidence.

    Your treatment of WTC on page 347 is probably the most egregious example of substituting your opinion for historical fact:


    In a final bit of irony, it was determined that a fire that later destroyed WTC 7 on September 11 was probably caused by the rupture of the building’s special diesel fuel tanks...


    What evidence do you site to back this up? The FEMA report on WTC 7 admitted that their scenario for the collapse of WTC 7 had “only a low probability of occurrence.” NIST has repeatedly delayed its report on WTC 7 (now scheduled for July, 2008). How can you state as fact that fire destroyed WTC 7 without backing it up? This substitution of mere assertions and opinions as “historical” fact seriously undermines the credibility of your work.

    Sincerely Paul Mozina paulmozina@wi.rr.com

    Posted 16 years ago #
  12. truthmover
    Administrator

    Welcome PaulMozina,

    Looks like you identified some of the more blatant bias demonstrated by the author of this book. I think most of us here and in the movement at large suspected that the book would be biased toward supporting the mainstream view. However, I think its good to keep in mind that many with a mainstream bent need to take one step before they can take three. In other words, while your criticism of the book is justified, the book might still generate some curiosity or skepticism in its readers that might lead them to more of the truth. Criticizing the report does imply the need for a new one, and that's a large part of what the movement is trying to achieve.

    Do you think it might be possible that the author had this in mind, and was trying to reach a more mainstream audience that might not accept the more theoretical side of our movement?

    Posted 16 years ago #
  13. NicholasLevis
    Member

    Shenon is not interested in helping the movement. His book is basically the stuff the daily paper didn't print. Not publishing about these issues assisted the cover-up while it was happening. Printing it now is some help to us, but is meant to sell the book.

    Posted 16 years ago #

Reply

You must log in to post.